The most recent Christian Chronicle has an ad by a church that is looking for a preacher. “Evanglistic Pulpit Preacher Needed.”
Part of the ad says: “We are looking for a man who wants to be right not radical, a man of wisdom and understanding who truly believes the song ‘Just As I Am’ and permits the gospel to change people’s lives according to “THE faith once delivered to the Saints.” Change agents, misguided, or unlearned men who desire to forget the old hermeneutic pattern of, who is speaking, to whom is he speaking, and when is he speaking, or Command, Example, and Necessary Inference need not apply. We are seeking a man to continue these God inspired biblical traditions taught by men of faith like those listed above [G. C. Brewer, C. E. McGaughey, Rex Turner, Sr., John Henry Clay].”
Just this reflection: My guess is that if they find someone who really believes the song “Just As I Am,” he won’t get the job.
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Just a few more recent pictures:
Sheesh … better count me out on this job application. I just don’t think I would qualify for them.
And, thanks for reminding my how blessed I am to be where I am.
I think I know someone who would fill that position quite well.
On a brighter note, that sure looks like a sweet baby!
At least they’re upfront about all that nonsense. It would be bad to learn all that after you’ve dragged your whole family there for an interview.
I would be interested in knowing just how many responses they get to their ad.
“We are seeking a man to continue these God inspired biblical traditions taught by men…”
Interesting phrasing. In the past, it would have been a clear sign it was NOT written by anyone who claimed to be in the Churches of Christ.
Hi Mike
Love the picture of Reese. You and Diane never looked more contented. Jena looks like a model for a new moms magazine.What fun to love and spoil the grandbaby and then let Mom and Dad handle the rest. Grandchildren are God’s reward for raising teenagers. Wish I could be more positive about the ad for a pulpit minister. Isnt a demand for being right rather than Christlike what got us where we are today? Following God inspired Bibical traditions are right as long as they are those of Jesus, loving each other, looking for ways to cooperate and care for the walking wounded all around us. Not being so right that we make more of the walking wounded. Just asking.
….taught by men of faith
It changes the meaning.
Precious precious..what a doll!
That ad saddened me, and it was like reading a blast from the past….the 1950’s!
As an eyeguy, it does my heart good to see such a young one wearing UV protection. Maybe that one, at least, won’t get cataracts.
As to the ad, even Roman Catholics have their Pre-Vatican II, Latin Mass only thank you very much reactionaries.
Whatever.
“…a man who wants to be right…” I thought we were called to righteousness, not rightness. Big difference.
Preacher ads. Reading through them, it is obvious that preachers do not write these ads. An elder friend of mine was looking for a preacher and he sent me over his ad. I told him that only two kinds of preachers would answer his ad: a man with a superhero complex or a young buck who has never done it but still thinks he can do anything. I advised him to keep this little thought in mind while composing his ad: from one frog to another, here’s why you ought to come to our pond.
Anyway, most of the ads are nonsense written by elders / leaders who evidently do not have a clue as to what the life of a minister is all about.
Thankfully, there are exceptions.
Hmmm……..I wonder if Jesus could have gotten hired at that church? The cards are already stacked against him in that he doesn’t have any initials at the beginning of his name.
I think he also pretty much fit into the “change agent” category.
I’m sorry the wedding robe thingie pretty much knocked you out of the running for being considered for this position. Blame Steve and Kathy!
DU
Hooteewho this ain’t something from the 1950’s. It is alive a well today. And it is all around us. They still are more concerned with form than function and “getting things right.” I guess Jesus knew they would always be with us, because HE spoke clearly to them 2000 years ago when HE got on them about counting seeds. What we have to guard against is our own weakness to fall into these same traps. Anytime we start getting comfortable with who we are, and where we are, then that means we are probably making it all about “us.” That’s where all of this starts. It was never suppose to be about “us.” It is about loving one another, not loving ourselves and what we are comfortable with. So if somebody brands you a “change agent” just look at them and say, “thank you.”
Regarding the church that wants a preacher who “truly believes the song ‘Just As I Am.’” Hmmm. So they want a candidate who has one dark blot in his soul, who is tossed about with many a conflict and many a doubt, who has fightings and fears within and without, who is poor, wretched, and blind. Why, they want the apostle Paul! God bless them!
How does that old song go?
Just as I am without one plea,
but I was right; yes that was me.
We will be having dinner with Reese and her parents (Mark and Jennica or something like that) tonight. We will enjoy time being with the Cope’s, watching our 2 babies, and seeing who wins American Idol. (Matt and I don’t care about Idol. We are just watching it because Jenna and Kayci do. Wink-Wink :))
Josh Ross has been an “Idol-holic” since the beginning. He’s also a ‘change agent’ of churches. Very dangerous.
Doesn’t everybody refer to Jesus as J.C. Superstar? Now He can apply!
Mike, what are you doing looking through the preacher want ads? If you’re looking to make a move, I’m sure we could find a job for you here in Conway. Do you sing? (Oh, I forgot about “Mike Cope Sings the Classics.” Scratch that.) How about Junior High ministry? Do you do lock-ins?
As troubling as that ad is, what troubles me more is the obvious line that has been drawn by so many of our churches.
There is seldom any more “we” but now it is almost always “us” versus “them”. This is such a dangerous worldview and has led to so many people being hurt and wounded throughout the entire journey of faith.
Will we ever get to a point where we will just allow others to be where they are in their journey without feeling the need to judge and belittle others points of view?
The humor in this is that most any talk like this makes one seem like a far right conservative which is so very far from where I personally am in my journey.
I guess I am just tired of how easy it has gotten for me to say “look how wrong they are to think I’m wrong…”
That is a beautiful baby. Makes the Preacher ad what it is, irrelevant.
Beautiful Reese!
Glad you’re preparing her to be “California Beauty” with those shades while basking in the sun!
I wonder how well it would go over if Preachers got to advertise in he same way.
Preacher, with 10 years experience Married and two young sons looking for a congregation that desires to fulfill the Great commission of Going, Teaching, Baptizing, and Discipling. Their desire to fulfill this commission goes far and above simple lip service.
The congregation must have Elders who are spiritual Shepherds, spend hours a week in prayer and study and knows every member by name and the desires of their hearts.
Would be nice if the members of the Congregation were able to work out their own pettiness, but not required. Also would be a bonus if the congregation loved to pray together, and could sing real well.
If you believe that you are the right congregation for me to bring my family into and raise them up loving God and His children please send me your resume and a letter from your last three preachers at …
Thanks for putting the happy AFTER the sad.
(On an earlier note, if my sister continues to claim Yankee pride, please ask her to name 5 Yankees. Sheesh.)
If you are fortunate to have every thing right why would you want to change?
Your pictures cause me to sin (envy), so you will have to stop eating meat.
A friend of mine sent me this ad and I thought surely it was a joke, but wouldn’t you know that truth is stranger than fiction.
Our fears often drive our need to “super qualify” what we want.
I think any preacher or leader should study sociology along with theology to be able to deal with the strangeness that ministry often brings into play.
Peace.
I believe there must be some accountablity on the part of the Christian Chronicle, ACU, Harding, OCU, and others on what kind of churches that they let post on their sites. I have seen numerous churches that are looking for ministers every few months. Numerous churches that are crazy standards for ministers which leads to burnout. Churches that go through splits and look for ministers ever couple of months or years need to screened and checked for what is going at your church that we want to post your church again and sent our fresh grads out to your church. Warn fresh grads about churches like the post your talking about Mike. Warn ministry majors about words such as “change agents” “right kind” “right kind of faith” “right doctrine” “traditional” “etc.”
It is my prayer that in the future all churches will get rid of the labels and united as one. I believe with our generation it will happen. It is going to just take some time and patience.
“It’s Hard to be Humble”
Shouldn’t all preachers be change agents? If a sermon leaves everyone in the congregation unchanged, what was the point of preaching it?
I supposed Jesus could not apply due to being a known “change agent.”
Just as you are, but you must be like me
Believe in thy blood but not radically
And if your right then come to thee
O Man of men, please come, please come.
Just as you are, but you must be wise
To rid the church of change and compromise
To thee, whose hermeneutic is right in our eyes
O learned, non change agent, please come.
Just you are, come give it a try
Help us preach hell and tell sinners they’ll fry.
What? No Necessary Inference? You need not apply.
You misguided soul don’t come. Don’t come.
Just you are, poor, wretched, blind;
What are you crazy, are you out of your mind?
Your no G.C. or C.E., in fact you are dumb.
Keep preaching Christ, but don’t come.
Just you are, we wilt receive,
As long you line up with what we believe
and with Brewer, Turner, and McGaughey
Oh yeah, and John Henery … then come.
Just you are; send your applications
if you meet all the above conditions
and believe the inspired biblical traditions
Of men, of men, then come.
Amen Alex
Wow, what a cookie cutter job posting. Are they going to run a factory or pastor a flock? Oops…sorry about using the word pastor. I guess I’m out of the running.
Beautiful pics of baby Cope…Diane looks great too.
I believe Jesus was the first change agent that we should follow!
So, we all should be change agents!
Why don’t they hire the men they mention in the post if they like them so much?
They’re probably dead.
Nice ad. I think even if I agreed with all that, I would be afraid to apply for fear of being censored or canned.
Without one plea…but that thy blood was shed for me. I don’t think that fits “the old hermeneutic pattern”
“flee from evil”
I am so grateful to be worshipping at North Atlanta. I will be muttering that for the rest of the day.
The baby is just precious!
This ad really intrigues me. Is there a link to this ad on-line at Christian Chronicle? I am one of these who has to see it to believe it…call me “Thomas”.
That is just a strange assortment of preachers names to be dropping in an ad for employment.I have met McGaughey and Turner (who preached my grandmother’s funeral back in 1974), both who are now dead and know that Brewer died back in the 1950’s. I have met a lot of Christian preachers in my years and have read writings of many more, but have no recollection of a John Henry Clay…no disrespect intended to any of Clay’s admirers.
Who in their right minds would advertize for a preacher to emulate a few select preachers in the “brotherhood” from 50 years ago when there were other preachers of that time, equally “sound” with perhaps greater name recognition that were not mentioned? Who in their right minds would advertize for a preacher to emulate any man?It just doesn’t even sound logical to me. I’m not sure you could find preachers of today who even know who these men were! Do you think it was a joke or hoax to show how misguided some elderships can be?
If anyone has a link to this ad, I would love to read it firsthand. The more I have thought about this ad today, the more curious and scared I have become….Why would any preacher emulate anyone but Christ?
Thank goodness you had the great pictures of the beautiful Reese on the post to encourage me….because this ad has really freaked me out.
Yes, Jesus did pray for unity. However, he did NOT pray for unity without compromise.
I just love those pictures! What a sweet sweet baby!
When I read the ad in Christian Chronicle, my thought was although I thought the ad was poorly worded, the intent was they wanted a preacher whose foundation is Scripture, not one who takes his sermons from the writings of some popular author or the current “hot topic”. I took the names of the preachers mentioned to mean they were using those men as examples of the type preaching they wanted. If you ever heard any of them preach, you would know they quoted Scripture, not writings of men, not examples of what happened last week at Disneyworld or in the news. Let’s give the person who wrote this ad the benefit of the doubt and honor the convictions he was trying to convey.
Oh Beth how I wish you were right.
You brood of vipers, how can you who are evil say anything good? For out of the overflow of the heart the mouth speaks. Matthew 12:34
Reese is a doll baby! Was she getting ready to go to a baseball game with those “shades” on? I know y’all must be having the best time with her. Keep those pics comin’—–
Are you referring to the ad on page 15 of the Chronicle? If so, my copy does not say the same thing that your’s does. It says, “We are looking for a man with an outgoing vibrant personality who wants to be right not radical, a man of wisdom and understanding who will endeavor to maintain the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace, but still preach the whole counsel of God in love.” It starts out the same, but it has a completely different message than the one you quoted. It says nothing about change agents or hermeneutics. I have looked through the rest of my copy of the Christian Chronicle, but have not found anything else that is close to what you quoted in your post, Mike. Am I missing something or is it online instead of in the printed edition?
Interesting discussion. Thomas - a.k.a. bbeth - asked if there’s an online link to the ad. Generally speaking, you can find pdf versions of the most recent Chronicle by going to http://www.christianchronicle.org and clicking on PDF Back Issues on the left column. I just looked and the June issue is not available yet, but it should be soon. Just FYI. The ad in question is on Page 15, but I’d encourage you to take time to peruse all our ads.
It wasn’t more than three years ago that I was almost as paranoid and legalistic as that ad for a preacher. It began at Harding, worsened on the mission field and became a hard core of fundamentalism in New Mexico. Only after my ministry, faith and finances fell completely apart and I walked through the dark valley of agnosticism was I able to begin to see the blue sky of freedom in Christ again.
Now if only I can get back into missions and do some good this time….
One thing about the wording of the ad that grabbbed me is how dangerously similar it sounds to part of the Scripture Jesus quoted in Matthew 15:9–”Their teachings are but rules taught by men.”
I get it. Faith traditions are only valid if you wear robes or worship monkeys. Your road to progress depends on the trashing and destruction of “God inspired biblical traditions”, only to replace these traditions with your own uninspiring traditions. Not to mention the constant trashing of God fearing men not alive to defend themselves. Beth is right, even though you loathe the word. The ad is poorly worded. The intent is intentional, and apparently understood. If the ad is trashed on this site, mission accomplished.
I just wanted to clarify that I meant no disrespect to the ministers mentioned in the ad. Bro. McGaughey stayed in our home when I was a child while conducting a gospel meeting at our congregation; Bro. Turner spoke at my grandmother’s funeral; Bro. Brewer was a favorite teacher of my father’s and I have a tape of his sermon “The Twenty-Third Psalm” that moves me to tears everytime I listen to it. These were fine gospel preachers and role models for young preachers in that time frame, but these men would be the first to speak up and say “preach the gospel” to any minister who would be seeking employment.
Bobby, I had looked at the Chronicle on-line but didn’t find the ad, so I will check back for it in a few days. Thanks for the information.
Did Jesus use examples of everyday life from time to time, instead of just scriptures (which means what we call the Old Testament). I’m pretty sure he did. Man, even Jesus himself couldn’t get that gig.
Because of ads like that, is why it took almost three years of searching to find a congregation with whom I could serve in and along side of.
Now on to the more important matters…
That is one beautiful grandchild. God bless her life!
Mike, Why, why? You give us so many good blogs to inspire and encourage. Why even bring up this ad. A discussion of it will eventually bring out the worst in all of us.
I agree with Troy.
It must be very nice to be so confident in YOUR rightness that you feel so comfortable sneering at the belief system of your supposed brothers.
Or do you not consider the more conservative among us “brothers?”
I think there is a difference between disagreement and sneering. How do we (Christians) ever make progress or challenge one another without openly confronting certain ideas or methods with dissenting viewpoints? As a forum of dialogue, the internet does not privatize conflict but makes it public and open to conversation partners. I would rather someone disagree with me over the net and allow me to participate in the conversation than to be critiqued behind close doors. We must be able to make a distinction between oppossing an idea(s) and attacking the people that hold them.
“The beginning of thought is in disagreement , not only with others but also with ourselves.†Eric Hoffer
Disagreement usually doesn’t take the form of sarcasm and calling other people’s views “all that nonsense.”
That ad is really sad. Reese is precious and you and Diane both look like you are in heaven.
I LOVE that “change agent” is still being used. LOL!!!!!
I understand that some are upset when fingers are pointed but there comes a point when we have to address that restrictions and exclusivity are not what Jesus wanted from us. These restrictions and exclusions have caused pain and pushed some away from Jesus. Jesus wants us to be salt and light…people who bring hope and light help others to sit in Jesus’ lap. I know so many who are struggling because of their contact with Churches of Christ and I don’t think that is what Jesus intended when he asked us to his bride. I don’t believe that Mike intended hurt with his mention of this employment ad…only to bring it out into the light.
Just as you are asking for all of us to see the people who posted this ad in the best possible light…please give the same to my friend Mike.
“Change agents, misguided, or unlearned men who desire to forgetâ€
this is what they call people who do not agree with them. It is not their belief that is troubling it is their arrogance.
Isn’t there a line…”has broken every barrier down…now to be Thine and Thine alone”?
Looks like a few hurdles/barriers to jump over and through to me.
The ad to which Mike referred is on the lower left side of page 9 of the May 2007 Christian Chromicle.
What I love is when you see articles about these “Change agents” and what happened at the Tulsa Workshop, for example. Ever wonder how they know? Do they send out spies to these events because many times they are very detailed in their knowledge.
I am somewhat bemused (note: not amused) that a people who claim to “speak where the Scriptures speak and be silent where the Scriptures are silent” or “call Bible things by Bible names” so often resort to bandying about terms like “change agents” or “necessary inferences.”
Clint-
“Change agents” are NOT what we call people who don’t agree with us. It’s what we call people who have a hidden agenda to “enlighten” the rest of us (brothers in Christ) on spiritual issues. It’s what we call people who come into a church with the purpose of aligning with like minded members in order to split the church over worship style. It’s what we call people like Randy Mayeaux and Rick Atchley. The difference is that Randy had sense enough not to destroy a strong church in order to promote change.
Found it, Coping.
Thanks.
Whatever we think of the ad, there are appoximately 25,000 souls in that area who need Jesus. We need to pray for God to send the man He needs to tell them about Jesus and pray for the congregation to welcome that man and support him in his ministry.
“Change agents” I just love that 90s term.
It ranks right up there with “Partheans, Meads, Dwellers of Mesopotamia.”
There is a lot of “we” and “they” on both sides of the aisle.
When I read that ad, I see a group of people who fear losing something they hold precious. They fear for themselves and for their children. Right or wrong, they believe they must follow the old paths (as they understand them) in order to obey God. I for one do not doubt they love God and are striving to obey him.
Looking a little deeper, I think I see another group of people who are driving that fear. Those people likewise love God and are striving to obey him according to their understanding. They see the first group as obstructionists, as a threat to the progress they long to experience.
I wish both sides could be healed of their insecurities toward the opposite group. Why can’t we accept one another? It is not before each other that we stand or fall, but before God. And he is able to make us stand… that is, he is able to make both groups stand.
Victor, don’t feel like the Lone Ranger! Lots of us have been bemused for YEARS. I believe God has been bemused for centuries.
And He still loves us!
DU
From reading the comments and the post, it seems that it has become rather easy to criticize or critique. From a “distance.” It must be good to be so enlightened.
Thanks for clarifying that it was in the May issue. They really improved the ad in the June issue.
Earlier commenter wondered who G.C. Brewer et al were…When I hear about G.C. Brewer I always think of the original Harding library (before renovations in 1990) which had a little-used, tiny interior room called the “G.C. Brewer Room.” In it were his desk, chair, and his personal library. You could lock the door to this room, and it was a great place to make out!
Alan, I wouldn’t say us and them. I would say us…all the way…us. We are all part of the Church of Christ. It is our denomination. It is my history. It is my family. I love and honor that background…my history and my family. I acknowledge the gifts that my denomination has given me and others…a rich history of singing, passion for the Word, connections all over the world within the Churches of Christ, confidence in the waters of baptism, congregations with individual personalities, summer camps that allow youth from a region to know each other deeply and a Christian College network that educates and grounds young adults. I am sure there are more but those are off the top of my head. I have incredibly positive memories from my church growing up…Sunday school, picnics, close friends to slumber party with, adults who loved me intensely, and a wild youth group that was also deeply searching.
But I found as an adult that there were some teachings and theology that didn’t seem to mesh with the Jesus that I was encountering. I am absolutely not condemning but yes, I am challenging some of those beliefs. I am glad that conversation happens…and yes, sometimes it has to be heated discussion. There are strong passions from all branches of our family. I did say earlier that the Church of Christ is my family but my family has grown…grown to include the universal body of Christ. I still am a very committed member of a Church of Christ. I think that we all have a responsibility to look at our families honestly…we need to see the flaws and possibly retrieve a few skeletons from our collective closets.
I don’t think that is asking too much.
I will say that one of the men mentioned is actually attached to my husband’s family tree and I would love to have this kind of conversation with him.
I am shocked. An ad, or a person who is not progressive get mocked. Is it fair for the traditional/conservative side (of which I am not on) to mock us? That is the biggest issue in the church today. If your church chooses to be change agents, do it. If you believe that the “old hermeneutic (sp) is the way to go, you should not be teased because of it. Shame on both sides.
You are trying to reconcile with the Christian Church but cannot within our own brotherhood. When will we get it?
Chris,
I’m not sure there’s mockery going on, but from my personal experience, I cannot remember any “progressive” congregations that have disfellowshipped anyone because they held the more conservative views. Unfortunately, and sad to say, that has not been my experience with the ‘conservative’ congregations and individuals. Some of whom have told me I was straight on my way to the fires of Hades because I had “abandoned” the conservative, traditional, or as was put to me “right way” and “right fellowship.”
There is room for growth on both sides in extending grace to the other, but there is a great deal of trepidation, even fear on my part to seek out those that hold the conservative POV. I have been deeply hurt by some and their judgment of me and the congregations with which I have chosen to worship and and serve.
I agree with the person that wrote of the paradox of our outreach to the Christian Church but our difficulty doing the same within our own fellowship. But then, we usually find we can reconcile more easily with an acquaintance than we can, at times, with a close family member when there are disagreements. The same is true in church fellowships, imho.
I’ve forgiven the judgments slung at me, but have yet come to full rebuilding of trust in those that have repeatedly hurt me so deeply. Prayers gratefully accepted that trust be restored.
Kathy,
My issue is that judgement is coming from both sides of our brotherhood. No more should a church say “conservative, fire and brimstone (sp) preachers need not apply.” Chances are that add would not be placed, but I think we all know there are churches with that attitude. Again, I am probably more progressive in my faith, worship ect… than I am traditional. I hate, HATE,HATE the fact that we seem to sling arrows at each other. Mike was mocking the church that placed the add, as well intentioned as he may have been. My opinion is that the side that has decided to stay traditional simply gets chided for their decision.
Let me ask you this: Would you be more likely to NOT attend a church that did not have praise team (which my church has) or go a church that you fundamentally disagreed with their doctrine? I am afraid we (me included) would chose worship we were comfortable with over soundness of teaching/principals.
I guess something snapped in me today. I am sorry if I offended.
So Troy,
you agree with the rest of my statement!
I don’t imagine I will gain any friends - and will probably lose a few more - but I’ve already expressed the way I feel about this a few times: Do We Really Need Them?, and A Comprehensive Hermeneutic, and its Part 2.
And I’ll confess that my initial reaction to the ad upon seeing it was not admirable.
But I’m trying to do better.
Clint-
At the risk of being labeled arrogant, I disagree.
I would like to know the background of this church. Did a prior experience promt this ad?
In an earlier blog you wrote:
“Having my kids spend a couple hours with Landon Saunders. Move over Garrison Keillor. The greatest voice and the greatest storyteller in America is LS.”
Can you help bring me up to date on what Landon is doing know and how he could be reached? I, too have fond memories of hearing him speak. I still remember his words like no other preacher. He was way ahead of his time. I would like to interview him about his life. Please let me know how I can reach him or his agent/staff if there is such a thing.
Let me ask you this: Would you be more likely to NOT attend a church that did not have praise team (which my church has) or go a church that you fundamentally disagreed with their doctrine?
If I “fundamentally disagree(d)” with any church’s doctrine, that I feel is not in accordance with God’s revealed will, I could not attend no matter the “form of worship leader(s), instrumental or non-intrumental.
“…no matter the “form of worship leader(s),…
What? Really, I was not referring to the svelteness or lack of same of the worship leaders. LOL I’m trying to read here AND watch the Cubs vs My Padres baseball game, hence the weirdness of sentence structure. How about this?
No matter the form of worship or whether there are leader or leaders, instrumental or non-instrumental, God’s word and worship of Him is primary, Jesus and Him crucified, raised and ascended to return for us is of primary concern. The rest of congregational time together is for lauding Him and building up the saints, imho
Now back to baseball.
Mike,
Why are you looking at the job listing on the Christian Chronicle? Should Highland be worried? Just kidding…
You look at the way progressive churches place ads: Seeking minister with “people skills”, “purpose driven mindset”, or “seeker friendly”, “emerging church focused”.
So, should we be suprized to see such an ad?
I say since the churches of Christ are non-denominational, let them do what they want. I say if Richland Hills want to do something a certain way that is up to their leadership. If Highland does something different that is up to highlands leadership. If a conservative traditional church wants to things a certain way, let them do what they want to do. Let us all remember thought that Love is the essential. Love is a must! We must love our brothers whether they and I hate labels (I hope in the future we could get rid of the labels) but if they a conservative, progressive, middle of the road, we all should love. If we have not love then it all means nothing. The world will know us by our love.
I for one see nothing of riducule or derision in Mike’s statement. But I do think that we should be careful about how we speak about the “other side”. I have searched the scriptures and their meaning and as a result have changed many of the positions I was taught growing up. My parents continued in those positions. But my mother was one of the most godly people I have ever known and my father suffered from Lou Garreg’s desease and never complained, only looking forward to going home. Though their system of religion I now see to have a very devisive element in it I know they never desired to but please the Lord. I know a loving God has accepted them into paradise. Let’s be careful of our judgement of another’s servant and watchful for our own pride.
Perhaps in changing the ad the church has rethought at least the way they want to appear to others and maybe more, Kent
I just keep thinking of a quote from an earlier blog with a similar tone. I cannot quote word for word, but the general idea went like this… A conservative only loves those to his right, and a liberal only loves those to his left. We really need to try not to fall into either category.
It is much easier to accept those more conservative than yourself, than to accept those more liberal than yourself. The “change agents” need to be more sensitive to the issues of conscience that face their more conservative brothers and sisters. That’s a big part of the message of Romans 14 and 1 Cor 8. We have a lot of room to grow in that area.
Can someone tell us when (and where) the unscriptural term “change agent” began to be used and why it has found such favor with a people who profess to only speak where the Bible speaks? And are they saying they have no need of change? Isn’t authentic repentance true change?
You’re killin’ me, Mike. Hilarious comment.
And still much nicer than when Paul was when said that he wished the legalists would “go the whole way and emasculate themselves”! I’m sure some of his blog commenters would have been VERY unhappy with him.
Victor, I believe the term “change agent” was first popularized by progressive preachers in the church in the 80’s to describe their agenda to liberalize the brotherhood. It is a term used in sociology or educational philososphy. Alarmed at the opinions expressed by these voices, writers/preachers have drawn attention to the self-described “change agents” and the label now seems to be a litmus test of compatibility, if not fellowship.
BTW, I’m extremely conservative, personally know a blogger or two in this forum and want to encourage everyone to not despise those you disagree with (”speaking the truth in love” - Ephesians 4:15). Sarcasm is usually very unbecoming to a Christian and is very entertaining to an unbeliever who stumbles upon this forum.
This Sunday’s sermon (on Memorial Day Weekend) will be taken from 2 Tim. 2:8-14, where Paul tells Timothy to remember the gospel, the death and resurrection of Christ, and not to be involved with disputes that are unprofitable.
Now, let’s get with it and start taking the gospel to the world. We’ve got work to do–starting with our own neighbor.
(Judges 10:14), God told them: “Go and cry to the gods which you have chosen; let them rescue you in the time of your torment.”
I guess God is not very Christ like much less His Prophets.
Most ads have code words that identify if a church is to the left, right, or middle. Many preachers have made the mistake of thinking a church was progressive, when they were really in the middle or even the right. In the CoC, before I took a job, I would interview the elders. A preacher should not take a CoC job, until they know for sure, with as much certainty as possible, the elders are inline with the preachers beliefs.
I’m behind on my blog reading…and late with my two cents…but it looks less like they want “Just as I am” and more like they want “Just as we think we’ve always been”
I just found this blog today. When I read a blog that A. makes light of someone who is concerned with having a minister that is devoted to the scripture as the men listed and B. the open comment that the blogger wouldn’t be hired at that congregation, makes me wonder what kind of minister the blogger would be. G. C. Brewer, for example, studied at the feet David Lipscomb. Here was a man who began his ministry during very trying times for the brotherhood. Instead of ridicule and mockery, the blogger ought to address his statement that he wouldn’t be hired at a congregation that desired someone like G.C. Brewer. For that is the most telling piece that I have seen written here. Since there is no kinship between the blogger and men like G. C. Brewer, when is the blogger going to admit there is no kinship between himself and the church of Christ. For the history of the church in America springs forth more from men like G. C. Brewer, David Lipscomb, J. W. McGarvey, Roy Lanier Sr., than it does from men like Rubel Shelley, Max Lucado and Rick Atchley. I will say this for Max Lucado, he was honest enough to remove church of Christ from the sign. I wonder when Highland will.
Brian, I thought it wasn’t a denomination….Why do you care who uses the name?
Donna,
It is patently dishonest to want to retain ties with a group of people with whom you hold no kinship. If you are going to be truly “liberated” from the shackles of the restoration movement, you should fully commit to removing all outward ties to that movement. Now I don’t think I mentioned denominationalism at all in my post. But it is evidently on your mind. You are right in your assumption that I don’t consider denominationalism a thing to be desired. Nor do I think that the goal of the restoration movement founders was to create another denomination. Their aim was to recreate New Testament Christianity. They sought to break free from the bonds of their Protestant roots. They dedicated themselves to the goal of speaking where the Bible speaks, and being silent where the Bible is silent. They determined to call Bible things by Bible names. Those goals in and of themselves distinguished them from other groups. And it was a worthy aim and goal. Having said all of that, I will say that I owe no allegiance to any of those men. My allegiance is to God. As a result, those who claim to be brethren and yet feel no kinship with those exceptional men should for integrity’s sake, divorce themselves from all vestiges of the movement those men gave their lives in service. I just cannot fathom someone retaining ties with people with whom I have nothing in common. I couldn’t sleep with myself at night if I continued to live a lie. Can you?
That baby is beautiful. I’m sure you are so proud!
- Kayci Ross
Strange that what we consider sad in this day in age is true and sound doctrine. What we want is change, innovation, and that which tickles our ears and entertains…because of this, people who wish to adhere to Biblical teaching are seen as out dated and old fashioned.