Comments on: The B-I-B-L-E #7 http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7 Sniffing out the work of God in the world... Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:24:55 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: Steve http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9750 Steve Wed, 29 Mar 2006 13:36:30 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9750 Test Post. Peace. Test Post.

Peace.

]]> By: Calvin (G'ampa C) http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9748 Calvin (G'ampa C) Wed, 29 Mar 2006 04:56:15 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9748 Thanks again, Mike. And to qb - come back out from under the rock. I appreciate your concerns and yearning for truly shepherding shepherds. I grew up in a small(er) church with three elders who mostly just ran things with iron fists. Many years later my father bacame an elder there (long after my departure). He hauled people to church, he fixed widow's appliances, he shoveled snow, he gave people a bed when they had none, he fed people who were hungry. His counsel was simple and deliberate, and maybe thereby profound. He served with love and a soft hand, even though I remembered him as strict and rough when I was a kid. He had an 8th grade education, and felt unequal to the task in many ways. What made him an elder couldn't be learned in books because he hadn't much book learnin'; he had a servant heart. It's great when elders are highly educated, but I bet they would tell you that education is fourth or fifth down the ladder from love and servanthood. I believe you have hit your answer right on the head. A small group of voices from the pews take on a long-term job of setting out elders from within. When our desire is to stimulate the love and servanthood of Jesus in those around us, we will see change, though it might seem slow. My Father was not a loving servant because he was a good elder, he was a good elder because he was a loving servant. Unfortunately, God doesn't snap his fingers and make us be what we should be, he grows us into what we should be using our experiences and the people around us, and his Spirit pulling and pushing and whispering in our ears. I ramble thus to say this: It may be your urging and loving and supporting that brings someone to the point of true shepherding. You may even have someone right next to you who is SERVING the church as an elder should without "Elder Status". In truth, it is a remarkable blessing to have elders like Highland has, and I thank God for them, but not one of them came to that point on their own. Us plain ol' members can either support, encourage and stimulate them to their service and leadership of the church, or we can let them go it alone. I talked to a Highland elder tonight who was almost elated to be able to set out a time for my prayer request. I just can't imagine he got that way by himself, but I'm sure glad that God and the people God used helped him get there... Thanks again, Mike.
And to qb - come back out from under the rock. I appreciate your concerns and yearning for truly shepherding shepherds. I grew up in a small(er) church with three elders who mostly just ran things with iron fists. Many years later my father bacame an elder there (long after my departure). He hauled people to church, he fixed widow’s appliances, he shoveled snow, he gave people a bed when they had none, he fed people who were hungry. His counsel was simple and deliberate, and maybe thereby profound. He served with love and a soft hand, even though I remembered him as strict and rough when I was a kid. He had an 8th grade education, and felt unequal to the task in many ways. What made him an elder couldn’t be learned in books because he hadn’t much book learnin’; he had a servant heart. It’s great when elders are highly educated, but I bet they would tell you that education is fourth or fifth down the ladder from love and servanthood. I believe you have hit your answer right on the head. A small group of voices from the pews take on a long-term job of setting out elders from within. When our desire is to stimulate the love and servanthood of Jesus in those around us, we will see change, though it might seem slow. My Father was not a loving servant because he was a good elder, he was a good elder because he was a loving servant. Unfortunately, God doesn’t snap his fingers and make us be what we should be, he grows us into what we should be using our experiences and the people around us, and his Spirit pulling and pushing and whispering in our ears. I ramble thus to say this: It may be your urging and loving and supporting that brings someone to the point of true shepherding. You may even have someone right next to you who is SERVING the church as an elder should without “Elder Status”.
In truth, it is a remarkable blessing to have elders like Highland has, and I thank God for them, but not one of them came to that point on their own. Us plain ol’ members can either support, encourage and stimulate them to their service and leadership of the church, or we can let them go it alone. I talked to a Highland elder tonight who was almost elated to be able to set out a time for my prayer request. I just can’t imagine he got that way by himself, but I’m sure glad that God and the people God used helped him get there…

]]> By: Brad Giddens http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9747 Brad Giddens Wed, 29 Mar 2006 04:48:48 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9747 John Alan Turner, You're right. I wouldn't swing the pendulum too far, just enough to keep some churches from putting all their eggs in the basket of a pedigree. The Spirit-led, Spirit-filled guy is too often cast aside for the guy with the letters after his name. Now the guy (Mike Cope) who has both (Mike Cope), there's a great treasure to be cherished (Mike Cope). God can use either one, and does regularly. Praise Him for that! I didn't get to your classes at the workshop. I hope they went well. God bless. John Alan Turner,

You’re right. I wouldn’t swing the pendulum too far, just enough to keep some churches from putting all their eggs in the basket of a pedigree. The Spirit-led, Spirit-filled guy is too often cast aside for the guy with the letters after his name. Now the guy (Mike Cope) who has both (Mike Cope), there’s a great treasure to be cherished (Mike Cope). God can use either one, and does regularly. Praise Him for that!

I didn’t get to your classes at the workshop. I hope they went well. God bless.

]]> By: Beverly http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9745 Beverly Wed, 29 Mar 2006 02:43:11 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9745 Wow..Mike..only 17 comments..I guess we are all just pooped out after yesterday's post... My Great Grandfather was a POW in Philadelphia during the Civil War. A woman slipped a Bible through the bars and he read the Bible during his imprisonment. What wonderful sustenance for a hungry heart. After the war he and two other guys started a christian college in Highland Home, Alabama. The word is powerful. Wow..Mike..only 17 comments..I guess we are all just pooped out after yesterday’s post…

My Great Grandfather was a POW in Philadelphia during the Civil War. A woman slipped a Bible through the bars and he read the Bible during his imprisonment. What wonderful sustenance for a hungry heart. After the war he and two other guys started a christian college in Highland Home, Alabama. The word is powerful.

]]> By: john alan turner http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9744 john alan turner Wed, 29 Mar 2006 02:34:28 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9744 Brad, I would caution us from pushing the pendulum to far in the opposite direction from scholarship. Education is important (I dare say Mike wouldn't have read Deissmann if not for graduate school). Jesus may have chosen outcast, uneducated and untrained folks initially, but Paul had some letters after his name -- God managed to use him even with all that education! Brad,
I would caution us from pushing the pendulum to far in the opposite direction from scholarship. Education is important (I dare say Mike wouldn’t have read Deissmann if not for graduate school). Jesus may have chosen outcast, uneducated and untrained folks initially, but Paul had some letters after his name — God managed to use him even with all that education!

]]> By: Amy Boone http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9740 Amy Boone Wed, 29 Mar 2006 01:13:34 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9740 Question unrelated to this particular post: Can a person print out a page of a blog? I did the seemingly simple task of pushing "print" and only got a blank page. Weird. Any thoughts? Question unrelated to this particular post: Can a person print out a page of a blog? I did the seemingly simple task of pushing “print” and only got a blank page. Weird. Any thoughts?

]]> By: Brad Giddens http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9739 Brad Giddens Tue, 28 Mar 2006 23:00:20 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9739 Great stuff. Makes me wonder why we put so much stock into preachers with a masters, doctorate, etc. I can think of several churches who hired a guy for his education and their church tanked. Maybe that's why Jesus picked the outcast, uneducated and untrained, so His Spirit could be their education and qualification. Wish churches would sometimes put that in their job ad. Enjoyed hearing you at Tulsa. Great stuff. Makes me wonder why we put so much stock into preachers with a masters, doctorate, etc. I can think of several churches who hired a guy for his education and their church tanked. Maybe that’s why Jesus picked the outcast, uneducated and untrained, so His Spirit could be their education and qualification. Wish churches would sometimes put that in their job ad.

Enjoyed hearing you at Tulsa.

]]> By: Chad Nall http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9736 Chad Nall Tue, 28 Mar 2006 19:45:04 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9736 Great thought, Mike. Scripture points to the power behind the word. It directs toward that which truly saves. Scripture doesn't save. The one who inspired Scripture does. Great thought, Mike. Scripture points to the power behind the word. It directs toward that which truly saves. Scripture doesn’t save. The one who inspired Scripture does.

]]> By: qb http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9735 qb Tue, 28 Mar 2006 19:18:58 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9735 Mike, perhaps you would entertain a pitch for some distant, future bloggistry? I read Peggy Noonan's latest ("What Nobodies Know," 3/23/06) and could not help thinking about how it relates to the need for deeply pastoral attitudes, conduct and lifestyle in the local church. Maybe I'm being unduly influenced by the articles that Fleer and Siburt compiled in _Like a Shepherd Lead Us_, as well as Peterson in _Working the Angles_, but I don't think so. You always have such generous things to say about the elders at Highland, and though I dearly love and respect the men who serve at our church, I have to admit to a bit of wistfulness when I read those things in your blog. How very fortunate you are at Highland. Love, Shelly, Wray et al. have shown us what we might call a "Point B" in relation to overall, CONGREGATIONAL attitudes toward and expectations of the eldership. It would appear that many congregations, however, are at "Point A," with a stunted view of what elders really represent and who they ought to BE. (Let me tip my hand here: the corporate, megachurch mentality does not seem to help in this regard. We hear more about "governance," "delegated authority" and "performance measures" than we do about shepherding, contemplation, spiritual direction and spiritual formation.) So it all begs the question: how does a small group of voices from the pews go about the long-term task of stimulating a congregational move from Point A to Point B? Back under the rock whence I came, qb Mike, perhaps you would entertain a pitch for some distant, future bloggistry?

I read Peggy Noonan’s latest (”What Nobodies Know,” 3/23/06) and could not help thinking about how it relates to the need for deeply pastoral attitudes, conduct and lifestyle in the local church. Maybe I’m being unduly influenced by the articles that Fleer and Siburt compiled in _Like a Shepherd Lead Us_, as well as Peterson in _Working the Angles_, but I don’t think so. You always have such generous things to say about the elders at Highland, and though I dearly love and respect the men who serve at our church, I have to admit to a bit of wistfulness when I read those things in your blog. How very fortunate you are at Highland.

Love, Shelly, Wray et al. have shown us what we might call a “Point B” in relation to overall, CONGREGATIONAL attitudes toward and expectations of the eldership. It would appear that many congregations, however, are at “Point A,” with a stunted view of what elders really represent and who they ought to BE. (Let me tip my hand here: the corporate, megachurch mentality does not seem to help in this regard. We hear more about “governance,” “delegated authority” and “performance measures” than we do about shepherding, contemplation, spiritual direction and spiritual formation.) So it all begs the question: how does a small group of voices from the pews go about the long-term task of stimulating a congregational move from Point A to Point B?

Back under the rock whence I came,

qb

]]> By: SG http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9734 SG Tue, 28 Mar 2006 18:19:47 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9734 Wow! Almost a minor in Bible and I never knew that! The more I learn the more I realize I don't know anything. Thank you so so much for this series! :) Wow! Almost a minor in Bible and I never knew that! The more I learn the more I realize I don’t know anything. Thank you so so much for this series! :)

]]> By: Thurman8er http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9732 Thurman8er Tue, 28 Mar 2006 17:05:45 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9732 Mike, there are many of us who teach Bible classes regularly yet have no formal training, no university education in theology. Series like this...simple, informative, meaningful...help us to teach better. Mike, there are many of us who teach Bible classes regularly yet have no formal training, no university education in theology. Series like this…simple, informative, meaningful…help us to teach better.

]]> By: clint http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9731 clint Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:30:18 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9731 Mike i agree whole-heartedly, but boy is it not fun and encouraging learning more and more about the written word. Mike i agree whole-heartedly, but boy is it not fun and encouraging learning more and more about the written word.

]]> By: David http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9730 David Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:25:30 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9730 "The Bible I Never Knew" by Mike Cope Great series!! “The Bible I Never Knew” by Mike Cope

Great series!!

]]> By: Mike http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9728 Mike Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:18:42 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9728 Excellent point, Clint. A reminder that it is <strong>the gospel </strong>which scripture witnesses to that delivers us -- not a mastery of the sixty-six books of the Bible! Excellent point, Clint. A reminder that it is the gospel which scripture witnesses to that delivers us — not a mastery of the sixty-six books of the Bible!

]]> By: clint http://preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9727 clint Tue, 28 Mar 2006 15:12:10 +0000 http://www.preachermike.com/2006/03/28/the-b-i-b-l-e-7#comment-9727 We live in a good time where more and more light is put on our understanding of the bible, but what about the dark ages? If we are having a difficult time deciphering the word of God, did they have a chance? We live in a good time where more and more light is put on our understanding of the bible, but what about the dark ages? If we are having a difficult time deciphering the word of God, did they have a chance?

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